The Human race and 2nd ed Priests

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Captain_K
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The Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Captain_K »

the race as a class discussion has me thinking, why not do the same for humans, not so much race as a class but more human racial abilities. Not sure what they might be, but 3 primes seem less than adequate. Thoughts?

Second topic down this path, in 2nd edition clerics and druids became specialized priests (heck the illusionist was just a specialized wizard - possibly the best treatment of that class ever). The idea to dial up a priest that balances spells, armor and weapons was great fun and kind of the sort of race as a class rulings one would need to keep your race as a class in line race to race and with other classes.

We can learn from and apply what worked in the past.
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Persimmon
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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Persimmon »

Well for me the three primes plus the unlimited class selections are enough since I do enforce restrictions on classes for demi-humans. I can't think of too many racial abilities that would have positive game effects given the state of humanity. Maybe some save bonuses, -1 to Int rolls, race/species intolerance, propensity for genocide and environmental destruction?

I never really played second edition, but I do like the idea of more flavorful clerics with access to specific spells and/or abilities that distinguish them. The problem is coming up with them. Weapon choices are easy enough, in line with the deity/faith. They could get some kind of special spell or ability every so many levels like say, 1, 5, 9, 13, 17 or whatever. A completely specialized spell list would be cool, but harder to create and keep track of. But as I've said, I do like those a lot.

The Hyperborea RPG features Pyromancers, Cryomancers, Neoromancers, & Witches with discrete spell lists in addition to your standard clerics, druids, and magicians. And they have a shaman class where you pick between lists. You choose one arcane & one divine list between magician, cleric, druid, and necromancer. Plus you get some other abilities. I have ported this class over to C&C for Half-orcs as an alternative spellcasting class.
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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by serleran »

Many of the 2nd edition specialty priests were overpowered or vastly underpowered, such as Isis, for an example of over, with armor, access to magic-user spells, chosen spell immunity, magic resistance overall, and advancement rate as a cleric (so very fast) and/or Gond who is fun but not that powerful given they have no control/command over undead and may not even be able to exist anyway if the DM doesn't want firearms (arquebus) in the game (and if they don't exist, a major point of their abilities is lost.)

I will say some of the faith-based spells are very cool though.

I personally just have clerics gain access to one or two abilities based on their alignment.

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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Go0gleplex »

Some food for thought; We replaced a few of the Cleric powers with something more appropriate to the deity they were following. Some examples:

God of Light/Good/Life: Powers per book.
God of Fire/Air/Water/Earth: Turn/Command X Elemental and Element based spells
God of War: No Turn Undead and only minor healing. Weapon +1 x times per day and choice of +1 to STR, CON, or DEX.
God of Healing: No weapons allowed and not allowed to do direct harm, but all healing at +3 bonus, Turn Undead at +1, and Pacify (mechanic-wise, like Turn but putting hostile foes to sleep)

and so forth...was a lot of work...but it made for some verrrrry interesting campaigns at times. That was my group in the 90s before I moved to Oregon, the gaming equivalent of Death Valley. lol
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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Persimmon »

Yeah, for clerics basing what they can turn/command based on their (or their deity's) alignment/sphere of influence is an easy tweak that immediately adds flavor.
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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Fizz »

I really liked 2nd Ed specialty priests as well, but the spheres of influence were rather wonky. The default spheres really messed up traditional druids. However, Dragon Magazine #205 fixed these issues and made the spheres much more sensible.

Over the last while, i've actually been working on specialty priests for C&C. It follows the 2nd Ed methodology, but with expanded / updated spheres of influence, and using C&C spell lists rather than 2nd Ed's. Since i prefer the Birthright setting, there is some influence there, but it's applicable to any setting.

It's in pretty good shape, so perhaps in the next while i should tidy it up the file and make it available, if there is sufficient interest.


-Fizz

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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by paladinn »

Fizz wrote:
Thu Jul 28, 2022 4:54 pm
I really liked 2nd Ed specialty priests as well, but the spheres of influence were rather wonky. The default spheres really messed up traditional druids. However, Dragon Magazine #205 fixed these issues and made the spheres much more sensible.

Over the last while, i've actually been working on specialty priests for C&C. It follows the 2nd Ed methodology, but with expanded / updated spheres of influence, and using C&C spell lists rather than 2nd Ed's. Since i prefer the Birthright setting, there is some influence there, but it's applicable to any setting.

It's in pretty good shape, so perhaps in the next while i should tidy it up the file and make it available, if there is sufficient interest.


-Fizz
Definitely interested, sir!

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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Captain_K »

I made a rating system for each sphere, weapons armor, etc to try to balance and we did all our own priests. plus not all god's made their clerics good gaming priests.
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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Lurker »

paladinn wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 12:05 am
Fizz wrote:
Thu Jul 28, 2022 4:54 pm
I really liked 2nd Ed specialty priests as well, but the spheres of influence were rather wonky. The default spheres really messed up traditional druids. However, Dragon Magazine #205 fixed these issues and made the spheres much more sensible.

Over the last while, i've actually been working on specialty priests for C&C. It follows the 2nd Ed methodology, but with expanded / updated spheres of influence, and using C&C spell lists rather than 2nd Ed's. Since i prefer the Birthright setting, there is some influence there, but it's applicable to any setting.

It's in pretty good shape, so perhaps in the next while i should tidy it up the file and make it available, if there is sufficient interest.


-Fizz
Definitely interested, sir!
+ 1 to that :!:

I always like the idea of specialty priests and spheres etc. But that is one thing i never tried to house rule.
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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Fizz »

paladinn wrote: Definitely interested, sir!
Lurker wrote: + 1 to that :!:
OK, give me a couple days to tidy things up and put it in a nice format. Then we'll figure out how to get the file to you. :)

-Fizz

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paladinn
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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by paladinn »

Fizz wrote:
Thu Aug 04, 2022 5:07 pm
paladinn wrote: Definitely interested, sir!
Lurker wrote: + 1 to that :!:
OK, give me a couple days to tidy things up and put it in a nice format. Then we'll figure out how to get the file to you. :)

-Fizz
Hello Mr. Fizzmeister,

Have you gotten anywhere on this?

Thanks!

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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Fizz »

paladinn wrote:
Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:12 pm
Fizz wrote:
Thu Aug 04, 2022 5:07 pm
paladinn wrote: Definitely interested, sir!
Lurker wrote: + 1 to that :!:
OK, give me a couple days to tidy things up and put it in a nice format. Then we'll figure out how to get the file to you. :)

-Fizz
Hello Mr. Fizzmeister,

Have you gotten anywhere on this?

Thanks!
Indeed i have. It's almost ready, and i'm just proof-reading and formatting. Give me another day and v1 will be available. Sorry it took longer than expected.

-Fizz

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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Fizz »

paladinn wrote:
Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:12 pm
Hello Mr. Fizzmeister,
Have you gotten anywhere on this?
OK, the file (version 1) is ready. If everything went as i planned, every cleric and druid spell has been organized into my set of 21 spheres. Hopefully i haven't missed any spell, and likewise i hope i didn't introduce a wizard or illusionist spell. If i did either, let me know and i'll fix.

Now how best to get it to you? I'll try to get it on a server in the next day or so for general availability somewhere. But since you guys were so eager, i'll give you first dibs. Send me a PM with your email and i'll send it to you.

-Fizz

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paladinn
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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by paladinn »

Fizz wrote:
Wed Aug 10, 2022 11:31 pm
paladinn wrote:
Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:12 pm
Hello Mr. Fizzmeister,
Have you gotten anywhere on this?
OK, the file (version 1) is ready. If everything went as i planned, every cleric and druid spell has been organized into my set of 21 spheres. Hopefully i haven't missed any spell, and likewise i hope i didn't introduce a wizard or illusionist spell. If i did either, let me know and i'll fix.

Now how best to get it to you? I'll try to get it on a server in the next day or so for general availability somewhere. But since you guys were so eager, i'll give you first dibs. Send me a PM with your email and i'll send it to you.

-Fizz
PM sent.. Thanks for all your work!

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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Captain_K »

How about you upload it to the Knights of the Crusade?

I'll check yours against mine from the 2nd ed days....
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Re: The Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Captain_K »

upload it?
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Re: The Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by paladinn »

Forwarded

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Re: the Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Fizz »

Captain_K wrote:
Sat Aug 27, 2022 1:08 pm
How about you upload it to the Knights of the Crusade?
I'll check yours against mine from the 2nd ed days....
That is a good idea. I went to do that, but it won't let me register (though i could have sworn i had an account already). It says my email is "blacklisted"? Weird- it's same email i use for these boards.

-Fizz

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Captain_K
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Re: The Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Captain_K »

I found my stuff, I will upload to you via email soon. I will, if you OK it, email Troll Tim and see about getting you back on that site.
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Re: The Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Fizz »

Captain_K wrote:
Thu Oct 27, 2022 12:50 am
I found my stuff, I will upload to you via email soon. I will, if you OK it, email Troll Tim and see about getting you back on that site.
A few days ago I sent an email via the knightsofthecrusade online help, but i have yet to hear a reply. So yes if you have a shortcut for that, that'd be great. I'd like to share the document to everyone easily, and knightsofthecrusade sounds like a good way to do it.

Do you have a copy of my file? If not, shoot me a PM with your email address.


-Fizz

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Captain_K
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Re: The Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Captain_K »

I just logged into knight of the crusade. It still works.
checking PMs next.
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Re: The Human race and 2nd ed Priests

Post by Fizz »

Captain_K wrote:
Sat Nov 05, 2022 12:37 pm
I just logged into knight of the crusade. It still works.
checking PMs next.
For me it still says my email is blacklisted. So strange. Hopefully Tim will have a chance to look at it soon.

-Fizz

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