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Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:22 am

If you are a backer of Adventurers Backpack, you should have a preview of the class section today.

I thought maybe it would be cool to have everyone who is interested adopt a class. Then we know it's all been looked at, and we know whom to blame if it all goes sideways ;).

Suggestions would include:
  • Paste the section into your favorite word processor and do a spell-check.
  • Check the grammar, by hand or with some tool. You might be wrong, and they might disagree, but may as well.
  • Check that the armor, weapons, hd, bth, and ability list for consistency (e.g. the ability list at the end of the class description should have every ability cited above, spelled the same, same wording)
  • Check that each cited ability makes sense, doesn't have loopholes your players will drive a truck through, is not weirdly over-powered or under-powered, etc. Again, the Trolls may ignore your advice, but at least you tried.
  • Cite page numbers, paragraph location, anything to help the editors zero in on it.
  • Imagine the worst rules lawyer or munchkin you know whining "but the book says here..." reading the abilities. Nip it in the bud.

Post which class you are adopting. No harm in taking more than one, or taking ones other people looked at. Just seeing that everything has been looked at by someone besides Traveller and the Trolls. No need to repeat the errata here, just send where the Trolls asked you to (productsupport@trolllord.com)

I just checked The Archer.

Decide a class or classes to proofread and send your edits to the Trolls so we can have a high quality product.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:54 am

Archer and Arcane Thief. Thinking of doing an expanded Runes book and adding in an eastern flair with omamori to tweak the rune mark a bit. Waffling on a couple others still.

Edit: Okay. My bad. Misread things and wasn't aware you were talking editing but adopting into game. :oops:

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:30 am

I'll take the Thief

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:35 am

Good idea. Make sure those edits get to the proper authorities! To those whom take up the challenge, I salute you.

~O

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:56 am

I play tested the archer.. suggested it be the Marksman, good with any ranged weapon.. anyway, I'm in...

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:49 am

I'm in as well. I believe I read everything with the exception of the rune mark.
I will adopt the Warrior Priest as my initial pass and the non class specific pages at the beginning.
One part is corrections. The other part will be where clarity is needed. For example, the primal druid can cast divine spells and not prepare them. I would take that as cleric and druid - and can cast spells on a whim as even clerics and druids need to 'prepare' spells. Or I thought they did. :?

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:53 pm

Warrior Priest. No need to pray or prepare spells. Just gets 1 cantrip less than the cleric per level. Does this mean the WP can just fire off any divine spell he has a slot for at will? Yes, I know, barring any heal spells.

Does this need clarification or is it fire at will anything on the spell list? No list at all? Wow.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:54 pm

Harbinger. Can we cut that page out? That was Russian hackers for sure.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:11 pm

Warrior Priest
Error on Warrior Priest Healing Table. 5th level. 3d6 = 18 not 20.

Clarifications/Suggestions
1) Describe the need / purpose of range or change to “maximum” in the title. Range is between a high and low.
2) Spell casting ability. “Need not prepare spells”. If warrior priests do not need to prepare spells, as clerics or druids, this is a large offset compared to the other classes as players may potentially select from various sources such as Elemental Magic. Alternatively use the mana rules from previously in the chapter.
3) Spell casting ability. Are warrior priests able to cast all divine spells or only cleric spells (excluding druid spells).
4) Holy Symbols. Limit this to rounds per day based on warrior priest. Otherwise this may be an ongoing all day effect.

I will type up feedback on other classes tomorrow.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Thu Feb 15, 2018 5:14 pm

The Thief class

Looks conspicuously like the current Rogue class. Here are some ability comparisons:

Backstab: Basically the same as the Rogue, except the Thief is allowed to use this ability on an opponent that is "aware" of their presence. Not sure on
the functionality, but this ability will be deadly.
Climb Walls: Identical to Rogue's Climb ablility
Escape: Allows the Thief to shed non-magical bindings. The Rogue possesses no similar skill.
Find/Remove/Set Traps: Identical to Rogue's Trap ability
Hear Noise: Identical to Rogue's Listen ability
Hide in Shadows: Identical to Rogue's Hide ability, except no armor restriction
Move Silently: Identical to Rogue's Move Silently ability, except no armor restriction
Open Locks: Identical to Rogue's Open Lock ability
Pick Pockets: Identical to Rogue's Pick Pockets ability, except no armor restriction
Read Arcane Languages: Similar to the Rogue's Decipher Script ability, but allows the Thief to read Wizard/Illusionist writing and gives him a chance to actually cast from a scroll upon a successful check.
Not sure why a thief would be allowed to read magical script; this hearkens back to an ability high level thieves gained in AD&D 1E.


Thieves Cant: Identical to Rogue's Cant ability, with no armor restriction

The Thief can level up quicker than the Rogue, as the amount needed is lower per level after level 4. BTH is increased at level 4 for the
Thief compared with level 5 for the Rogue.

Weapon choice is almost identical (the Rogue can use a light hammer, mace, and sickle while the Thief cannot)

Armor choice is identical to the Rogue

I'm puzzled at this inclusion of this class. Most abilities are verbatim from the Rogue. I don't know that adding Escape and the ability to read / use magical script is enough to make the Thief a class of it's own.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:46 pm

Re: Thief

This is why of all the classes I was most at ease with bringing into a campaign.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:52 pm

The thief class is just a rogue that can bypass the armor restrictions. You can create that by simply adding a new advantage for the rogue class: "deft armored hand".

I am not impressed with the harbinger. Can I just list that whole class as something to fix?

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:10 pm

Checking the Pacer

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:19 am

Checking the Seeker

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:50 am

Sent to Trolls.
Seeker Errors:
And when all these fail, the are possessed
And when all these fail, they are possessed

There instincts allow them[/color] to solve riddles,
Their instincts allow them to solve riddles,

ABILITIES prior to the experience table does not have each of the class abilities capitalized like other sections.

Clarifications / Suggestions / Opinions
Temporal Entanglement - I'm not understanding this and feel it may be overpowered.

The write up for this class is not direct like other classes. It lacks the flavor and passion of other classes. It states what they are not, how they feel, and in the of the 3rd paragraph and first sentence of the 4th paragraph it starts to flesh out. Possible place the bottom work to the top and start there.

I would be willing to re-write if it helps.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:16 am

.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:32 am

LOL - very true. I work mostly with process maps, Excel, and Minitab.
I really do not like correcting others and avoid a lot of writing!
It's really trying to get a product on my shelf and make the Trolls look good.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:31 am

Aergraith wrote:Post which class you are adopting. No harm in taking more than one, or taking ones other people looked at. Just seeing that everything has been looked at by someone besides Traveller and the Trolls.

Just to clarify something, I've not seen the Adventurer's backpack at all. At this point in time I'm not anticipating any editing work on it, though that could change. I feel with Monsters & Treasure 5 on the horizon however, I'm going to have a pretty busy spring.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:51 am

Where do we actually see the preview? I'm a backer, but I haven't seen anything yet or gotten an invite from the Trolls in my email. Sight unseen, these classes sound at best redundant, at worst just plain bad. Can we back out and get our money back? This doesn't sound like something I'm going to use much.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:15 am

Persimmon - check your email box you use for kickstarters. There should be an email from Tuesday from Stephen Chenault.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:37 pm

Page 9
Harbingers are plane walkers. They possess an intimate connection with the planes beyond the material. At times they are aware of this, at others they come into the knowledge after much hardship and toil.
Intimate, Innate, or just “They possess a connection”
Uncertain of the value of the second sentence. Aware of the connection? and at other times the come into the knowledge – or that they make the connection

Class Reference Table 1
Harbinger and Seeker need to be corrected. (i.e., Harbringer and Seeksrs)

Harbinger Class – Page 18
Overall, I don’t think the Harbinger needs to be capitalized within a sentence.
Overall, is the Harbinger a plane walker, planes walker, or as Wizards of the Coast, planeswalkers / planeswalker?
Paragraph 3: Harbingers come from all walks of life, all races and genders. The sight knows no particular religion, nor philosophy or creed. Born with the second sight of the plane walker they are cursed or blessed, depending with whom you talk.
Is “The sight knows no” an error? What is meant by sight?
Comma after second sight of the plane walker.
After "second sight" is "of the plane walker" necessary?
FATE’S ARM: At 1st level the Harbinger chooses one weapon, piece of armor or even equipment that is associated with their character. The item can be any one from the equipment list in the Players Handbook, Adventurers Backpack or any other source material. Items range from swords and axes, to shields, helm’s, suits of armor or even an arm band, a pair of boots or ring. The chosen item is sentient and possesses an alignment and a will.
The chart does not show bonuses for armor, rings, boots, etc. I.e., 1st level bonus is +1 damage. What is the equivalent for armor, rings, boots, etc.
The sentence "The item is considered a magical item, its bonuses determined by its Will." should be up further in the text.

Harbinger Class – Page 19
Top of the page should read, "In addition, all items possess..."

Note if the item is not a weapon and is a ring, armor, boots, etc. the table may need to be adjusted. This should be noted, additional item purpose tables, or ideas provided.

If the item is destroyed the Harbinger loses one level per point of Will the item possesses
Comma after destroyed.
Period at the end of the sentence.
If the weapon is destroyed, how is a new item created?
As written, a 5th level character would lose 19 levels. Should this be worded as "loses one level per point of Will over 17"?
Plane Shift at 3rd level with unlimited duration seems very powerful. Perhaps this should be replaced with Ethereal Jaunt spell or removed until 10th level. At 3rd level, maybe a more suited bonus is more like the ranger ability changed to planar creatures.

Text within Plane Shift is "ethereal planes". Should this be singular? Or was the intent to have "astral and ethereal planes" as mentioned in the next ability?

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:05 pm

Heh, when I posted this topic I envisioned the only other posts would be names of classes people were proofreading, and then could scan the list and see if all 13 were being proofread.

Since that is not what happened, either I wrote my post badly, or everyone read it badly, and in either case none of us are qualified to proof read anything.

Apologies to Traveller, for some reason I thought you were point on this one.

Still, I'll proofread a couple more classes tonight.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:33 pm

Aergraith wrote:Heh, when I posted this topic I envisioned the only other posts would be names of classes people were proofreading, and then could scan the list and see if all 13 were being proofread.

Since that is not what happened, either I wrote my post badly, or everyone read it badly, and in either case none of us are qualified to proof read anything.

Apologies to Traveller, for some reason I thought you were point on this one.

Still, I'll proofread a couple more classes tonight.

I took your post as encouraging those of us who were interested in seeing the best product possible, take advantage of the preview we were given. I don't think there are any "gotchas", certainly not by me. I both proofread the class I chose and did a comparison to another class that I thought it closely mirrored because I thought it was relevant.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:46 pm

maximus wrote:
Aergraith wrote:Heh, when I posted this topic I envisioned the only other posts would be names of classes people were proofreading, and then could scan the list and see if all 13 were being proofread.

Since that is not what happened, either I wrote my post badly, or everyone read it badly, and in either case none of us are qualified to proof read anything.

Apologies to Traveller, for some reason I thought you were point on this one.

Still, I'll proofread a couple more classes tonight.

I took your post as encouraging those of us who were interested in seeing the best product possible, take advantage of the preview we were given. I don't think there are any "gotchas", certainly not by me. I both proofread the class I chose and did a comparison to another class that I thought it closely mirrored because I thought it was relevant.


Thanks, everyone who looks will make many CKs happier.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Sat Feb 17, 2018 1:27 am

Looking at Primal Druid and Skald

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Sat Feb 17, 2018 1:16 pm

Aergraith wrote:
maximus wrote:
Aergraith wrote:Heh, when I posted this topic I envisioned the only other posts would be names of classes people were proofreading, and then could scan the list and see if all 13 were being proofread.

Since that is not what happened, either I wrote my post badly, or everyone read it badly, and in either case none of us are qualified to proof read anything.

Apologies to Traveller, for some reason I thought you were point on this one.

Still, I'll proofread a couple more classes tonight.

I took your post as encouraging those of us who were interested in seeing the best product possible, take advantage of the preview we were given. I don't think there are any "gotchas", certainly not by me. I both proofread the class I chose and did a comparison to another class that I thought it closely mirrored because I thought it was relevant.


Thanks, everyone who looks will make many CKs happier.


Hey there - apologies for being a cause of leading your plans astray in that I didn't follow the rules and that I didn't post my intent. You had clear approach.

In posting, I thought I would:
1) show some of the errors that I found which could exist across classes which others may identify in their review in this siloed approach
2) reduce the amount of duplicate errors being reported to the Trolls from potentially multiple sources
3) possibly gain understanding on possibly why certain things were done

Regardless of reasons mentioned above, correct they did not meet the expectations set forth.

Again, it's wanting a better product. I think the Troll Lords are a good set of guys with a great product. I may not have said it here however, "The logical choice is 5e. It's a simple system, very popular, and easy to find players but heart is with C&C." It's that "bare knuckles" gaming.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Sat Feb 17, 2018 4:24 pm

Aergraith wrote:Apologies to Traveller, for some reason I thought you were point on this one.

Understandable, but really, there's no need to apologize as I'm not offended. I'm working on some Inzae material right now.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:44 pm

No problem, I just thought it was funny.

T1Hound wrote:
Aergraith wrote:
maximus wrote:
Aergraith wrote:Heh, when I posted this topic I envisioned the only other posts would be names of classes people were proofreading, and then could scan the list and see if all 13 were being proofread.

Since that is not what happened, either I wrote my post badly, or everyone read it badly, and in either case none of us are qualified to proof read anything.

Apologies to Traveller, for some reason I thought you were point on this one.

Still, I'll proofread a couple more classes tonight.

I took your post as encouraging those of us who were interested in seeing the best product possible, take advantage of the preview we were given. I don't think there are any "gotchas", certainly not by me. I both proofread the class I chose and did a comparison to another class that I thought it closely mirrored because I thought it was relevant.


Thanks, everyone who looks will make many CKs happier.


Hey there - apologies for being a cause of leading your plans astray in that I didn't follow the rules and that I didn't post my intent. You had clear approach.

In posting, I thought I would:
1) show some of the errors that I found which could exist across classes which others may identify in their review in this siloed approach
2) reduce the amount of duplicate errors being reported to the Trolls from potentially multiple sources
3) possibly gain understanding on possibly why certain things were done

Regardless of reasons mentioned above, correct they did not meet the expectations set forth.

Again, it's wanting a better product. I think the Troll Lords are a good set of guys with a great product. I may not have said it here however, "The logical choice is 5e. It's a simple system, very popular, and easy to find players but heart is with C&C." It's that "bare knuckles" gaming.

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:01 am

Great thread.

Any updates?

Re: Adventurers Backpack Editing: Adopt a Class

Tue Mar 06, 2018 3:09 am

I received a few emails from Tim or Steve for the feedback and some items that were overlooked. I think an updated copy will be sent but that may not be until they are done w Gary Con
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