The NEW Codex of Aihrde

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The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Omote »

To the Kickstarter backer's of the Codex of Aihdre, TLG released their Beta version of the book via .pdf. Steadily throughout the day I have been skipping around and reading small chunks here and there. I'm really impressed so far! This is nothing like the old World of Aihrde folio from 6+ years ago. This behemoth intends to be a 300 page book of deep history, and tons of details. I'm actually kind of in awe of how much there is to this book. Tons of heraldry, the Gods in deep, almost burdensome depth, and history, upon layer of history, upon layer of history.

I've never been a huge fan of the Aihdre setting; it's nice and all, and there are some parts that I thought were really neat, but never really had the use for it. Reading through the forthcoming setting book, I am excited to give Aihrde a really good try.

Dare I say, that this might be one of the most detailed backgrounds in a setting I have ever glimpsed!

But it seems, that the closer the reader gets to the current year within the setting, the details are only enough to get you going with a ton of wiggle room for your own ideas. That's pretty impressive. Lots of detailed uber-history to get a solid, deep setting, with just enough modern details to make it your own.

I'm really like what I'm seeing here Trolls.

~O
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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Omote »

Oh, and it seems that the Codex itself will be a stat-free zone! There's no mechanics in this setting book, so you could port it to your favorite system (which I'm sure is already C&C). That is also another good move Troll dudez.

~O
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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by tylermo »

Just skimmed through the latest version...looking good, Trollz!

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Treebore »

Yeah, I am impressed with the depth Steve has been adding to this newest iteration. Then again, we all got a taste of this in the Troll Blog. I've been using the Wilderlands lately, but this makes me want to swing back to the Airhde zone for my next campaign. (I have Aihrde and the Wilderlands on the same planet.)
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Snoring Rock »

I did buy into the kick-starter for the new Codex of Aihrde. I have the PDF and have looked it over quite a bit. I like it. Some of the history may not get used in my campaigns. The players like flavor but not that much.

My problem with Aihrde has been that the maps that come with the codex do not match the scale of the maps in the modules. I know, just change it and presto. I have to tell you honestly that, that answer is not the best answer. The two really need to be used together and the scale should be the same. My other problem is that the map shows two villages, that are very small, on a very large scale map. Botkinberg and Ludensheim are marked on the map. But the other towns that are much, much larger, are not. I prefer that the small towns, although important, are not on the map at all. I have the module that shows where they are. I think the large map should show cities and large towns and be consistent throughout. I know those villages are important but I disagree with marking tiny villages but missing larger one's.

The maps also have a lot of detail on the Darkenfold forest, but the rest is quite vague. In the same amount of space elsewhere on the map, there are few place names. But a walk through the Darkenfold, and every stream and hill has a name, inns are marked, the river crossings, etc. This is not a heavily populated place. I get it, the forest has a lot of history and lots of modules written for it. But that is the catch. In one way the lack of detail opens it up the CK to create. But the Darkenfold and Blacktooth Ridge are taken already. I am just saying that one reason I have not gone over to this setting, is the inconsistency. Back up and let me detail those areas. If I like the modules, then I will use them to detail those areas.

On the other hand, the lack of too much detail opens it up to be interpreted by the CK and the players. There is a lot of value in that. I dig that. The history is fantastic. I think that I will never use it all. I have been using the Wilderlands for a long time. I have some issues with that setting as well. I am holding out to see the new revised map. If the map gets fixed (scale, level of detail consistent) I will give this setting a try as well.

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Rhuvein »

Good to see Omote having some interest in Aihrde!!

I didn't join the kick on this release even though I really wanted to.

But I will buy the book for sure sometime in the near future ~ watching for a sale!

:)
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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Lurker »

Rhuvein wrote:
I didn't join the kick on this release even though I really wanted to.

But I will buy the book for sure sometime in the near future ~ watching for a sale!

:)

Me toooooooo !

S.R. I'd say I don't want the maps in codex and those in adventures to be the same scale. However, I do want maps to scale properly. But that is just my preference ....
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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Treebore »

Snoring Rock wrote: My problem with Aihrde has been that the maps that come with the codex do not match the scale of the maps in the modules.
I don't know of any product where the scale of the setting/world map matches up with the scale of the adventure/module maps. They serve completely different functions. Its like saying a world map should be the same scale as a regional or town map.
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
Sounds obvious to me! -Gm Michael

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Daniel »

Treebore wrote: Its like saying a world map should be the same scale as a regional or town map.
I remember the first time I worked with AutoCAD, it came with a map that allowed you to zoom down to a street map and zoom up to the planet view. The idea was to show off what AutoCAD could do. I rmember thinking at the time... "How long would it take me to do this for my game world."

What can I say, I am such a game geek. :lol:

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Treebore »

Daniel wrote:
Treebore wrote: Its like saying a world map should be the same scale as a regional or town map.
I remember the first time I worked with AutoCAD, it came with a map that allowed you to zoom down to a street map and zoom up to the planet view. The idea was to show off what AutoCAD could do. I rmember thinking at the time... "How long would it take me to do this for my game world."

What can I say, I am such a game geek. :lol:
Anna Meyers has pretty much done that for Greyhawk.

http://ghmaps.net/
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
Sounds obvious to me! -Gm Michael

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Snoring Rock »

Treebore wrote:
Snoring Rock wrote: My problem with Aihrde has been that the maps that come with the codex do not match the scale of the maps in the modules.
I don't know of any product where the scale of the setting/world map matches up with the scale of the adventure/module maps. They serve completely different functions. Its like saying a world map should be the same scale as a regional or town map.
You misunderstand me. What I mean is that in the campaign map, Botkinberg and Ludensheim are about 15 miles apart. In the module they are 90 miles apart. That is what I meant by the scale being off.

Also, the modules show about 6 towns, most of which are 10 times or more, larger than both named above. None of them show up on the campaign map but these tiny villages do. Am I to assume that the rest of the towns shown on the campaign map are 100 people or less? The large cities are not shown on the map?

I understand this is/was the trolls home campaign and that those villages are important, but not so in my campaign (possibly). I think you should go by size when showing settlements on a campaign map. Large one's first. Omitting cities with populations of 4000 or more but including populations of 1000, or even 100 or less just makes not sense to me.

Here is one for you; on page 68 of Rune Lore (also a module) is an adventure on an island. The island is located 175 miles north of the Hanse City States. Go get the map, which is 1 inch = 24 miles. If your start on the coast and go north from the point where the most water lies between land masses, you only get 130 miles. If you go to page 73 the map shows the location. Which is about 80 miles out. Oh and yes, the book states that by ship, it will take over a month to get there. WHAT?

There are no trade stops on the way, just open sea.

This inconsistency is what keeps me from diving head long into this product that looks so good. I am hoping the map scale gets fixed to match the modules. Now Treebore, before you go all "make it your own scale" on me, remember that there are module elements where time and distance are relevant to the adventure. When all the time, travel and scale are off, it kind of destroys the suspension of disbelief. If the CK is not careful, and deconstructs everything to make it right, he ends up with a table of players wondering. In that case, I should just take the time and make my own. I send money on published materials in order to save time.

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Treebore »

I buy to save time as well. I recall such issues when I ran the modules, but it took me seconds to decide what to do to "fix" them. I'm used to running into such issues from decades of working with such mistakes all the way from Dungeon magazine to darn near every module I've ever ran. So I guess its just become second nature to me to fix the problem, note it in my campaign notes, and move on. So it just never bothers me any more. I am sure it did in my earlier years, but I think (I in no way clearly recall) I just came to accept that no adventure was ever put together perfectly, and unless I had to rewrite large portions of it to make it usable, it saved me time. Plus if I ever bought an adventure that bad, I don't recall it, so I don't think I ever decided a module I bought was completely unusable.

As for unnamed towns/locations, that does bother me too. Judges Guild did that fairly often, or describe trade routes that bustle with trade with the many towns along it, then don't show any on the map, just the big starting town, and one, or possibly a few, towns along the way to the described end. If I need to fill that stuff in (I usually don't, I usually can just jot down names for a number of towns I am making up on the spot) with any detail, thats another way a large library of adventures come in handy, pull out ones with favorite towns, villages, etc... from other adventures I have ran, and use them for the detail. I've changed players often enough over the years they haven't seen the stuff before, or in the case of my kids, its been long enough since I last used it, they don't recognize it. If I really want to go all out, that is when I pull out things like the Tome of Adventure Design or Gary's books or other products I have bought to aid me with creating such things.

So I guess the bottom line is, I've dealt with such problems so often over the years, and have gotten comfortable with a kind of "routine" for addressing such short comings, that I really don't hold it against the products anymore.
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
Sounds obvious to me! -Gm Michael

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Snoring Rock »

You make good points Tree, but I still think Judges Guild did it best with the hex system. I have seen very few of those modules off on scale. They may have been Gonzo, and off flavor at times, but never shifted maps like TLG does.

Yes, they did describe heavily traveled trade routes that had little or no support on the map. I am in hopes that Steve brings the campaign map into agreement with the modules. The new Codex is a work of art.

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Lurker »

Snoring Rock wrote:
You misunderstand me. What I mean is that in the campaign map, Botkinberg and Ludensheim are about 15 miles apart. In the module they are 90 miles apart. That is what I meant by the scale being off.

Also, the modules show about 6 towns, most of which are 10 times or more, larger than both named above. None of them show up on the campaign map but these tiny villages do. Am I to assume that the rest of the towns shown on the campaign map are 100 people or less? The large cities are not shown on the map?

I understand this is/was the trolls home campaign and that those villages are important, but not so in my campaign (possibly). I think you should go by size when showing settlements on a campaign map. Large one's first. Omitting cities with populations of 4000 or more but including populations of 1000, or even 100 or less just makes not sense to me.

Here is one for you; on page 68 of Rune Lore (also a module) is an adventure on an island. The island is located 175 miles north of the Hanse City States. Go get the map, which is 1 inch = 24 miles. If your start on the coast and go north from the point where the most water lies between land masses, you only get 130 miles. If you go to page 73 the map shows the location. Which is about 80 miles out. Oh and yes, the book states that by ship, it will take over a month to get there. WHAT?

There are no trade stops on the way, just open sea.

This inconsistency is what keeps me from diving head long into this product that looks so good. I am hoping the map scale gets fixed to match the modules. Now Treebore, before you go all "make it your own scale" on me, remember that there are module elements where time and distance are relevant to the adventure. When all the time, travel and scale are off, it kind of destroys the suspension of disbelief. If the CK is not careful, and deconstructs everything to make it right, he ends up with a table of players wondering. In that case, I should just take the time and make my own. I send money on published materials in order to save time.

Ok, we are now talking about the same thing ... yes it annoys me too. Especially thinks like reading that it took months for a fleet to sail from point A to point be, then looking at the map and going 'how, were they sailing against the wind and current the whole way, because there is no way it would take 'months' to sail that far based on the distance.'

However, if you self the scaling and make it fit the story (or morph the story to fit the scale) it should work out.

Also, I agree about the issues on having 'minor' villages on the map but missing cities. It drives me crazy when a city is mentioned but no where to be found ...

However, even with those issues, I love the setting. I can live with those annoyances to get all the good stuff from it!
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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Rigon »

Who says the maps are supposed to be accurate? Real world ancient maps are often horribly wrong for scale. And just because something is written in a guide book, doesn't make it correct. Perhaps there was some bias by the cartographer that omitted that major city because his lord is feuding with a lord from that omitted city. There are any number of reasons for maps to not jive with a gazetteer. Incorporate those mistakes and let the players discover new and wondrous things.

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Snoring Rock »

Rigon wrote:Who says the maps are supposed to be accurate? Real world ancient maps are often horribly wrong for scale. And just because something is written in a guide book, doesn't make it correct. Perhaps there was some bias by the cartographer that omitted that major city because his lord is feuding with a lord from that omitted city. There are any number of reasons for maps to not jive with a gazetteer. Incorporate those mistakes and let the players discover new and wondrous things.

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I get you man, but this map is the CK's map and should be correct. What would be nice, is if we could get the PDF with a few tools for marking our own settlements. I am in hopes the trolls read some of this stuff and see my point.

The setting itself is really cool. It is not a jumble of good mixed with Gonzo or strange stuff. It makes sense. I just require a bit more sense. I like your take on mapping and distance etc., I just think the CK's master map should be the master map. But again to your point, and you have made it a few times on this forum, ancient mapping was an art, not a science.

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

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Snoring Rock wrote:What would be nice, is if we could get the PDF with a few tools for marking our own settlements. I am in hopes the trolls read some of this stuff and see my point.
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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Rhuvein »

I too had some problems with some of the maps back when I started with C&C. The local maps in A0 and A1 were fine, but we all wondered where the Blacktooth Ridge and Botkinburg were on the several Erde maps available at that time.

The text of the Codex of Erde helped a lot in figuring where cities were or were not. Not sure about the new Codex.

Like Tree, I'm less concerned about specifics and just make my own determination about distance and travel time.

I haven't seen the new maps but hope to get them someday.

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Daniel »

For me, it comes down to this: Do I NEED accurate maps or maps that at least match? No, I am more than capable of winging it. Would I enjoy having maps that were consistent and accurate to with the text? Of course I would.

When I look at game materials, I plan to use them for what ever I want and they often warp anyway by the time I am done. But it does help me if they start from the same place so I can be consistent in my game. :mrgreen:

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Omote »

Aihrde certainly has some interesting names. Referencing the new map of the Cradle of the World, I noticed the "Bearcoat Roughs." Bearcoat, really? Now all my players will always say when looking at that map is "B!4ch betta have my honey."

Oh Troll Lords.

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Treebore »

Omote wrote:Aihrde certainly has some interesting names. Referencing the new map of the Cradle of the World, I noticed the "Bearcoat Roughs." Bearcoat, really? Now all my players will always say when looking at that map is "B!4ch betta have my honey."

Oh Troll Lords.

~O

I'll definitely have The Land of Many Lakes be known for their butter.

Looking at the new map, made available today, I'd say it clears up a lot of questions around the lands of Blacktooth Ridge, however, I think it lays everything out differently than most sources we have seen before, but I won't be able to verify until I get home from Texas some time next week.
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
Sounds obvious to me! -Gm Michael

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Fosco »

Treebore wrote:
Omote wrote:Aihrde certainly has some interesting names. Referencing the new map of the Cradle of the World, I noticed the "Bearcoat Roughs." Bearcoat, really? Now all my players will always say when looking at that map is "B!4ch betta have my honey."

Oh Troll Lords.

~O

I'll definitely have The Land of Many Lakes be known for their butter.

Looking at the new map, made available today, I'd say it clears up a lot of questions around the lands of Blacktooth Ridge, however, I think it lays everything out differently than most sources we have seen before, but I won't be able to verify until I get home from Texas some time next week.
Where can I find this map, pray tell?

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Omote »

I just checked Fosco, apparently the map I mentioned is not yet available on the Troll Lord Store site, or RPGNow. Looking back at my e-mail, it appears that the updated Aihrde map is part of the Codex of Aihrde Kickstarter from a year ago or so. I think TLG is giving out that reward (finally). I would think that the updated map would be available as soon as the Codex of Aihdre is put up for sale, probably after it ships out to backers.

The new map is an updated version of the revised map released last year around GenCon (I think). It was a a gorgeous map back then, and with this update there is a TON of new information on it. Lots of sites have been names, cities, and more geography defined. As Treebore and SnoringRock have mentioned here, and other places, the new map seems to have some corrections added in as well regarding scale and locale placement to better suit the adventure modules. I'm still waiting for the print version of the map, but the digital version is really nice.

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Re: The NEW Codex of Aihrde

Post by Fosco »

Thanks for checking, O.

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