Elfin Lorebook of Facts ~ The elven book of elfiness

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Omote
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Elfin Lorebook of Facts ~ The elven book of elfiness

Post by Omote »

Five years from now...

So Castles & Crusades is a mondo hit. Hundreds of thousands of copies sold. Buckets of money pouring into the TLG coffers (CKG still not released...) and then what?

We would have our great PHBs, M&Ts, but then what else?

Where could C&C go from there?

TLG has said in the past that they have no plans to release anything like the ole' "Complete Book of X" series. So what's ahead in the distant, long-term future for C&C?

I know books like this have been done before, and TLG seems purely against "crunch" books, but why not another round of Books of Elves or some such goodness? Not every book has to be filled with a ton of stats, numbers, classes, etc. What about a good book of elves (dwarves, halflings, gnomes, whatever) that features a TLG-style ELF RACIAL CLASS, racial weapons, homeland notes, artifacts, noblility, religion, roleplaying notes, tomes of importance, sinister cults, dark histories, and the finer details of TLG elves?

I think this would be pretty cool. I'm not an advocate of tons of new rules, classes, etc, but not every sourcebook has to be such.

Personally I would like to see this for C&C, and down the road I don't want to see TLG run out of ideas. Yeah, modules and Aihrde will be great, but then what... Not every C&Cer will want to get into Aihrde, or the Wilderlands... but Wilderlands fans, Aihrde fans, and core book fans will like a book about C&C elves. I think other fans would like to see this too... you may not NOW (because your excuse will be *whines* Ehhhhh, I've already got my Compelte Books of Everything from 15 years ago... ehhhh), but what about 5 years from now, where eveything old is new. You'll be back for the books...

...and I'll be waiting.

..................................................Omote

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meepo

Post by meepo »

I prefer the two (or three depending on how you view the CKG) book path we have now, with the only support from here on out being primarily through adventures, and also revisons, accesories (dice, screens, etc), sourcebooks/campaign settings, and novelties (minis, stuff like the personalized books, other silly things fans can buy). A beginners boxed set in the vein of the old B/X sets would be nice too, soley designed to teach the game to newbies, thus making it different from the collectors set.

I see "Complete Thisorthat" books as a downhill money sink that detracts from the simplicity of what we have right now. I hope the Trolls avoid these things like the plague!

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Post by Treebore »

The only thing like that I am interested in is the Elvin history of Erde. Then Dwarves. Then the Unklar. Doubt I would be interested in anything else. I would be happy for someone to prove me wrong, though.

I could definitely go for something along the lines of the "Aurora's Whole Realms Catalogue", or whatever that wonderful thing is called.
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
Sounds obvious to me! -Gm Michael

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Inkpot

Post by Inkpot »

The problem is that elves have been done to death in just about every game system you can imagine. Unless the Trolls could put a truly unique spin on our pointy-eared friends, my opinion on a future elf book is officially 'meh'.

Now if they were to release a book of the fey, I'd be on that like stink on.....brussel sprouts. But, they'd have to avoid that damn incessant Walt Disneyfied Tinkerbell cliche. I'd want to see the historically accurate, non-victorianized fey.

And I'm probably all alone in that wish....but dammit, I want that!! =)

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Post by DangerDwarf »

I'm not a big buyer of "Complete" type books and such. Most of my RPG buys (outside of modules) are settings, city sets, etc.

If there were racial books or such out out, I'd likely buy them if a majority of the work was fluff, with little crunch. Also, I'd demand the elf book be called "Sissified Leaf-eaters".

Even so, I'd much prefer such information to be found in setting books / products.

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Post by DangerDwarf »

Inkpot wrote:
And I'm probably all alone in that wish....but dammit, I want that!! =)

Actually, nope. I can definately agree with you there. Aihrde elves could hold my interest because they seem far more classical style elves. In my campaign that is how I use them as well.

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Post by serleran »

A product like that, unless specifically tailored to the Airhde game world (or any other setting possibly released by TLG down the line), has about a 1% chance, if that. Now, it being licensed and released by someone else... maybe much higher, but as stands, TLG is not interested in splatting the C&C system.

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Post by Rigon »

Not too interested in "Complete"-type books. Give me lots and lots of campaign related stuff and adventure mods.

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Post by Treebore »

There are some good "old style fey" books out for the d20 market.
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
Sounds obvious to me! -Gm Michael

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Post by Omote »

While ultimately I like the idea of these kind of books, especially in a C&C way, I don't think TLG can keep on, keepin' on by promoting the same 2 or 3 books (core books). Yeah, new campaign settings are one thing, but as history tells us, such products never sell as well as "core" books. Maybe TLG is not intersted in this particular way of thinking. Maybe profits arn't TLG's primary goal. I don't have a problem with any of this, but you have to think that one day, maybe more then 5 years away, splat books may make a comeback... if not, what will be the books of 5 years future; setting books only?

..........................................Omote

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Post by Inkpot »

Treebore wrote:
There are some good "old style fey" books out for the d20 market.

The only halfway decent attempt I've come across so far is "The Little People" sourcebook for Celtic Age D20. If you know of others, please share!

Ink

P.S. Don't mean to threadjack...I can start a new post if y'all like.
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Post by Tadhg »

Interesting questions/ideas Omote (Omotay), and maybe very hard to call as to what to do or where to go in the next to five years. It seems like the RPG market may be on the decline and I'd be hard pressed to predict what products will sell (although TLG and maybe a few others should continue to do well).

For the short term - CKG, modules and continued setting enhancement material for Aihrde and other worlds. The "Complete Book" idea to me, might not be bad, IF they combine all the classes and characters and make it a small book or module size release. No fluff, but maybe Aihrdian variations of the major classes/races would be interesting.
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Post by moriarty777 »

Treebore wrote:
The only thing like that I am interested in is the Elvin history of Erde. Then Dwarves. Then the Unklar. Doubt I would be interested in anything else. I would be happy for someone to prove me wrong, though.

I could definitely go for something along the lines of the "Aurora's Whole Realms Catalogue", or whatever that wonderful thing is called.

I *LOVE* that book... and the title is correct... I liked to format.. the art... hell... everything about it!

What I'd like to see... once the revised C&C Airde (Erde) is established is maybe something along the lines of the 'Poor Wizard's Almanac' not just in terms of the ongoing story (history) of the campaign setting but the occasional new factions... creatures... spells... you know that sort of bag of odds & ends which are really cool.

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Post by Maliki »

Rigon wrote:
Not too interested in "Complete"-type books. Give me lots and lots of campaign related stuff and adventure mods.

R-

My thought also, I did the whole complete everything books in 2E, have a lot from 3E and really don't see the need for them in C&C. I am a much bigger fan of modules and settings. Now a book about races/classes specific to Erde would be 8) .
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Post by Omote »

moriarty777 wrote:
What I'd like to see... once the revised C&C Airde (Erde) is established is maybe something along the lines of the 'Poor Wizard's Almanac' not just in terms of the ongoing story (history) of the campaign setting but the occasional new factions... creatures... spells... you know that sort of bag of odds & ends which are really cool.

Now wouldn't THAT be cool. I love those books, great idea and filled with tons of good setting information.

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Post by Jyrdan Fairblade »

I'll also chime in on how awesome that book is.

I wouldn't mind seeing campaign resource books a la the wilderness and dungeoneer's survival guides, as well as extraplanar sourcebook and the proposed Oriental Adventures book. An urban adventures book would be cool as well.

I'd also like to see a book that's about playing the game from the monsters point of view, but more like the complete book of humanoids than savage species.
Treebore wrote:
I could definitely go for something along the lines of the "Aurora's Whole Realms Catalogue", or whatever that wonderful thing is called.

angelius

Post by angelius »

Just promise me TLG that if/when you release sourcebooks please please,

make them Source Books!

Not like the crap that other d20 companies are releasing. Which is mostly, prestige classes, new feats and spells packaged in a hardbound costing like $$$.

I know so many 3rd ed players, that just can't take it anymore with that stuff. I'm trying to convert them to C&C.

If TLG had to release new material, my votes would be for,

1. New adventures

2. New campaign settings

3. Atlas, maps etc.
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Post by johns »

The trick of releasing new material is that there is so much material already out there that is compatible with C&C. You can get a pdf of Aurora's for $5 from rpgnow. Even monster books are tough - we have three from AD&D, nine or ten major releases for 3.5, one for C&C with one more planned, etc.

I think adventures and developing their own campaign setting are the way to go. New monsters, new magic items, etc would be great for inclusion in modules or in the Crusader.

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Post by Jynx »

Personally, I like to see more adventures.

However, why not more settings created for C&C so as not to only have one that may not appeal to everyone? I would love to see a new Horror setting but not a copy of Ravenloft. A more modern setting would be cool as well. I think the key to capturing the attention of new players is to have more hip and modern settings. I don't know much about the current TLG setting.

Maps are always great!

A monster book every now and again would be cool as well. Not every 6 months as with some other companies!

Rules aren't my cup of tea. Idon't care much for the complete series and whenever I buy a new Eberron book I feel like tearing out all the Prestige Class and New Feats in it. I go for the FLUFF only.

I think this will be a difficult decision to make, but at some point in order to stick around, I suspect that TLG will have to do something to capture more players. It's not enough to continue to offer the same old stuff.

Inkpot

Post by Inkpot »

I want to see some Airhde fiction!! A string of novels that will do for C&C what Drizzt did for D&D.
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Post by DangerDwarf »

Inkpot wrote:
I want to see some Airhde fiction!!

I wholeheartedly agree there. that would kick ass.
Inkpot wrote:
A string of novels that will do for C&C what Drizzt did for D&D.

Create a horde of rip-off clone characters?!?!? NOOOOOOOO!

Inkpot

Post by Inkpot »

While I agree with you that Drizzt is one of the most overdone and overcloned characters I've ever seen, his marketability cannot be denied. The plain fact is that little pointy-eared dollar sign made bajillions. I'd love to see this happen for TLG, as well.
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Post by Jyrdan Fairblade »

Much as I hate to admit it, I've really enjoyed Devil's Due Publishing's adaptations. Probably because the limited space prunes the stories into trimer versions.

But what character could (or should) be "iconic" to C&C?
Inkpot wrote:
While I agree with you that Drizzt is one of the most overdone and overcloned characters I've ever seen, his marketability cannot be denied. The plain fact is that little pointy-eared dollar sign made bajillions. I'd love to see this happen for TLG, as well.
Ink

meepo

Post by meepo »

Jyrdan Fairblade wrote:
But what character could (or should) be "iconic" to C&C?



*drool*

Inkpot

Post by Inkpot »

How about a druid? Druids are rarely depicted as main characters in mainstream game/book adaptations, from what I've seen. I dig druids.

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Post by serleran »

How about a potato(e) farmer?

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Post by Dakhysron »

Inkpot wrote:
How about a druid? Druids are rarely depicted as main characters in mainstream game/book adaptations, from what I've seen. I dig druids.

Ink

Hey Ink, have you played Rob Kuntz's Dark Druids yet?

As far as what books I'd like to see, I don't really care to see a complete this or that.

How about a campaign cookbook? I think it would be cool to have a book broken into sections based on terrain (each terraing section may have a city sub-section). In each section have scores of adventure ideas (just a few lines) and how they could tie into other adventures throughout the book. Have each section broken down into adventure type: hack-n-slash, problem solving, role playing... This book would also include new monsters and treasure fitting to the adventures.

You could even have a short chapter in the front that presents several ideas for an over-arching theme for the campaign and if you choose arch x then offer a suggested list of adventures from sections x, y, z, ect.

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Post by Jyrdan Fairblade »

Well said, Meepo!

She's named in the books, too, isn't she?

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Post by DangerDwarf »

Jyrdan Fairblade wrote:
Well said, Meepo!

She's named in the books, too, isn't she?

I like to think of her as Aleena's hot sister.

meepo

Post by meepo »

DangerDwarf wrote:
I like to think of her as Aleena's hot sister.

Haha! I LIKE it!!!

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