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Default Mood of C&C

Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:23 pm

Okay, time for another sleep-deprived topic from the whorls of my brain!

What is the default mood of C&C? Is it grim / dark fantasy, high fantasy, sword & sorcery, silly (in the sense of quirky a la Vance), folkloric, etc?

While that may seem a simple question, consider the following: tone of writing, artwork, content, etc.

C&C is pretty open to personal interpretation, but I posit the following: it is high fantasy with grim underpinnings. Darker than D&D 2e or 3e, but naturally not as much as say, Warhammer Fantasy.

Why? Paladins, some quite heroic art, and a tone of high adventure and magical wonder in the writing. This is contrasted by the Assassin core class, poisons, at times moody black & white art (not that all b&w art is dark by nature), and plenty of undead villains.

To contrast this with AD&D 1st edition, I think there was a definite feel of high/grim/silly fantasy to it, while classic D&D was more straight high fantasy feel to it.

Any thoughts?

Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:29 pm

I believe C&C is sword-and-sorcery / grim fantasy with a heavy emphasis on epic stories. Its not as S&S as say, Conan, but the seeming lower magic overall (emphasized by the treasure tables and the fact that there are fewer spellcasting classes in C&C than in AD&D), but I get that sensation when reading over much of the game material. It definitely is grim, with combat being designed to be "fast and deadly," though I hope my writing of the monsters helps (I do tend to be dark...)

Fri Jul 07, 2006 6:07 pm

Personally C&C is classic Sword & Sorcery to me.

Fact of the matter is that everbodies intepretation of sword and sorcery, high magic, etc is going to be slightly different.

C&C is not high magic like 3E seems to me, but tis defintely not grim, gritty, dark fantasy as presented in the PHB, M&T by any stretch of the imagination.

.......................................Omote

FPQ
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Fri Jul 07, 2006 6:15 pm

Is there really a 'mood' to C&C?

Personally I think not. To me, it's just a basic RPG System to build on and not a setting, so I don't even see the 'mood'. Just my opinion anyhow!

hmmm....

Fri Jul 07, 2006 6:19 pm

Jynx wrote:
Is there really a 'mood' to C&C?

Personally I think not. To me, it's just a basic RPG System to build on and not a setting, so I don't even see the 'mood'. Just my opinion anyhow!

hmmm....



I agree for the most part. The only mood I get is from the artwork (which is very nice, GT, some of the finest in any of my RPG books) being so unified throughout the rulebooks. Other than that, I think C&C pretty much can wrap itself comfortably around any fantasy theme (and possibly other genres as well), as seen in the A vs. U series of modules, Goodman Games adventures, the light hearted 'Killer' modules by miller6, and the most recently posted Dragonlance conversion.

One size fits all - and I love it!

Fri Jul 07, 2006 6:19 pm

While I don't really attach a mood to the PHB, there is definately a mood put out through the modules.

I like the slightly "folklorish" mood to some of the modules.

Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:00 pm

I do feel that the rules, a they are written, lend to a lower magic grim and gritty game. As has been pointed out though, it still comes down to the CK and the campaign they design. Or the modules, and how much of them, the CK uses. The very essence of why I love RPG's.

Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:51 pm

It's what you make of it...and that's the beauty of it...versitility.
I sure am happy with it.

Brian Miller
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Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:54 pm

I tend to lean towards "high fantasy with grim undertones". Reading the Codex of Erde forces me to arrive at this conclusion. Knightly codes, romances, and the epic style in which the book is written all remind me of Mallory's Le Mort de Arthur and similar works. And then there's the Warhammer feel to the naming conventions and underlying evil ala GW's "Enemy Within" campaign that gives it just the right amount of grit. I think we can safely assume that the forthcoming revision will evoke a similar feel. HOWEVER, C&C is infinitely expandable, and can encompass any playstyle you can imagine.

But, on it's own, I'd say Excalibur-Meets-Warhammer. And that's exactly how I like it! =)

Ink
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Fri Jul 07, 2006 10:44 pm

I don't see one mood in C&C, IMHO the rulebooks (PHB & M&T) don't really have a mood to them. The modules vary in moods. The "A" series is very epic in feel, like the characters are part of something much bigger. Fingers of the Foresaken Hand is higher in magical tone, as are the Goodman modules. Plus much of the mood will be put in by the CK, even those running the same modules will tend to run things differently.

If anything C&C is sort of middle ot the road, and can easily lead where the CK wants
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Fri Jul 07, 2006 11:15 pm

lol this is probably quite silly, but the use of wizard vs. Magic User makes it more high fantasy to me... never liked the word Wizard.
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Fri Jul 07, 2006 11:29 pm

It is all styles and all moods to all people who call it theirs.

8)

Sat Jul 08, 2006 2:21 am

magehammer wrote:
It is all styles and all moods to all people who call it theirs.



Really, that is quite perfect in the way to describe this topic. Obviously C&C is a lot of things, a loit of ways to many different people. C&C is what it is... great.

....................................Omote

FPQ
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Sat Jul 08, 2006 2:24 am

Well, for me, the default mood comes from the boxed set. The rules were fast, easy and old school. Then after viewing the intro adventure, I knew that this was exactly what I needed to return to the game.
After reading the module The Rising Knight, I purchased the Codex of Erde and that's where the real "mood" of the game comes into play.

That world is in so many ways - Dungeons & Dragons. Sword & sorcery, Middle Earth, Blackmoor, Ravenloft, dungeon crawls, Greyhawk, Yggsburgh etc. all fit in perfectly!

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Sat Jul 08, 2006 2:27 am

I have to go with high fantasy. Wizards, Paladins, Tolkienesce Elves and Half-Elves. Also, Peter's artwork just screams high fantasy to me.

R-
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Sat Jul 08, 2006 8:37 am

If C&C has a mood its streamlined.
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Sat Jul 08, 2006 8:56 pm

It's hard to give a mood to something that is, in essence, a tool.

I'm going to say that it's default mood is standard sword & sorcery, in the same vein as AD&D/OD&D. From there, it is malleable enough to work for high fantasy, dark fantasy/horror, or any number of genres you can think of.
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Sat Jul 08, 2006 11:26 pm

You oughta do this topic as a poll. Be interesting to see how many gamers we have of each type.

Brian Miller
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"The adventure continues"

Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:27 pm

Combat_Kyle wrote:
If C&C has a mood its streamlined.



I have to agree there. That was my biggest impression from the Players Handbook. It felt wonderful as compared to the D&D 3.5 PHB which felt like rules lawyer heaven.

I will say, just to say, that I don't get a Middle-Earth feel from Castles & Crusades. It doesn't really have that Heroic Saga (Beowulf, Volsung etc) quality because it lacks that mythic element in favour of a bit more traditional fantasy element. It also, as someone pointed out, has more of that Romance feeling, something Professor Tolkien was noted as disliking.

This is not a knock on C&C, because I like it. I will admit I find a decided lack of Heroic Saga type RPGs disconcerting (since Pendragon isn't Heroic at all but Romantic). I prefer a grittier Dark Ages type setting, but I also find a more Romantic one appealing at times. I mean, who cannot love to play a Knight who lives by a Code?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:32 pm

I think mood depends more on setting than on the system.

I could very easily see running a Ravenloft campaign using C&C rules. That would have a very different feel than running, say, a Dragonlance campaign, which in turn would have a very different feel than Greyhawk.

Thulcondar
http://www.goldenfuture.net/Thulcondar

Wed Jul 12, 2006 8:01 pm

Okay, so now there's a poll option!

I've actually been thinking of running a Nordic Saga-influenced campaign using C&C and the Vikings historical green book from 2e.

Would it be Skalds and Sea-Serpents, then?

Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:12 am

I think the default setting comes form th players and the CK I mean each of my play test groups and also my 2 C&C campaigns are set in completely different moods, and historical era's and technology bases

ken
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Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:18 am

Jyrdan Fairblade wrote:
Okay, so now there's a poll option!



Hehe, still hard to pinhole. I chose "Grim fantasy", but I'm sure my world is that + sword & sorcery + mythic/folkloric + romance/chivalry!
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Count Rhuveinus - Lejendary Keeper of Castle Franqueforte

"Enjoy a 'world' where the fantastic is fact and magic really works!" ~ Gary Gygax

"By the pricking of my thumbs, Something wicked this way comes:" - Macbeth

Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:03 am

Well, I think of C&C base as being high fantasy with grim reality thrown in, most of that is from the artwork, though. For instance the picture of the cleric (think thats the one, dont have the book in front of me) with the hammer just evokes the feeling of worry and tension that come from the "fight or flight" response in preparing to face danger.
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