Gygax Magazine from TSR

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Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by Mimdalf »

Come December there will be a new gaming magazine Gygax Magazine from the new TSR. Discuss...

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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Mimdalf wrote:Come December there will be a new gaming magazine Gygax Magazine from the new TSR. Discuss...

Link?
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by DeadReborn »

http://gygaxmagazine.com/

There isn't much there, though. There is some more info over on Dragonsfoot.

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by CKDad »

Also on the Old School Gamers group on Facebook:
"Gygax Magazine is myself, Ernie Gygax, Luke Gygax, Tim Kask, James Carpio, and Jim Wampler. Our first issue is out in December; since it's not finished yet, we've been pretty quiet about things until it's ready.

Just to address some of the questions, I thought it was best that I leave a reply. We do own the trademark for TSR, and have since December of 2011. We are a new company, not the old TSR, as they were purchased by Wizards in the '90s. The trademark was abandoned about nine years ago, and we registered it in 2011.

We decided the best thing to release first as TSR was a gaming magazine, because we wanted a way to bridge the traditions of the old guard with the awesome new games that are out today. " - Jayson Elliot
And:
Tim Kask: The cat seems to have escaped the bag,,,,,,

I was approached about a year ago to do some consulting work, "If I was interested". I was, and remain so as I think that this may well turn out to be the most interesting gaming magazine ever done.

I can say that we have made a great effort to combine the best of the old and the best of the newer. We have commitments from some names that will blow your mind in aggregate. Never before have so many names associated with gaming ever graced the pages of a single issue. From art to articles, we plan to be awesome.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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Sounds cool!
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by Treebore »

I'll definitely buy it.
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by Sir Ironside »

Newish stuff from Gamers & Grognards by Tim Kask.

The line-up of talent looks awseome.

I hope this is a deadtree release.

Too bad C&C didn't get a shout-out considering Mr. Gygax's history and all.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by serleran »

Still in wait and see mode. There are other "names" I'd rather see. But, Foglio is a funny touch.

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by tylermo »

Who knew? Wonder if Castle Zagyg will see the light of day through the new TSR?

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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Who knew? Wonder if Castle Zagyg will see the light of day through the new TSR?

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by Treebore »

tylermo wrote:Who knew? Wonder if Castle Zagyg will see the light of day through the new TSR?

Since Gail is not involved in this I'd say "no".
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by tylermo »

True. Still with "Limbo" Games, I guess. The new magazine sounds interesting. Articles on Savage Worlds, and classic games could be a good thing.

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by trashheap »

I am likely going to be checking out this magazine.

Though I am almost more eager to see what kinds of other projects this new TSR Games picks up.

I guess it's too much to hope they might be able to dust off that Lejendary Adventure rewrite/relaunch that Gygax Games and Mongoose Publishing spun their wheels on a few years ago.

Troll Lord games should reach out to these folks and see if they can get some cross polination going with this magazine too.

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by CKDad »

I hope they can make a go of it, but the economic realities are really stacked against magazines these days. There are a few exceptions (c.f. The Economist or The Atlantic), but the factors that make them viable don't seem to translate to the niche market that is gaming.

I do think they have the right idea by going quarterly, and Jayson Elliot is actually making a go of another niche-market magazine (Permissions), so they've got as good a chance as anyone.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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CKDad wrote:I hope they can make a go of it, but the economic realities are really stacked against magazines these days. There are a few exceptions (c.f. The Economist or The Atlantic), but the factors that make them viable don't seem to translate to the niche market that is gaming.

I do think they have the right idea by going quarterly, and Jayson Elliot is actually making a go of another niche-market magazine (Permissions), so they've got as good a chance as anyone.
A very good point, in light of the news that Kobold Quarterly is folding. Many magazines in general struggle these days, especially those with niche following, like RPGs. Certainly I hope for their success and will support them as a subscriber, but my optimism is tempered by reality.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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CKDad wrote:I hope they can make a go of it, but the economic realities are really stacked against magazines these days. There are a few exceptions (c.f. The Economist or The Atlantic), but the factors that make them viable don't seem to translate to the niche market that is gaming.
Yep. And even these two are internally, a hollow shell of their past selves.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by Sir Ironside »

Arduin wrote:
CKDad wrote:I hope they can make a go of it, but the economic realities are really stacked against magazines these days. There are a few exceptions (c.f. The Economist or The Atlantic), but the factors that make them viable don't seem to translate to the niche market that is gaming.
Yep. And even these two are internally, a hollow shell of their past selves.
Well if the Gygax name is well known within all the gaming community (More the new breed of rpger's) and they get noticed by the D&D/Pathfinder crowd you have a pretty big base to draw upon. Plus putting it out in different formats will certainly helps.

I don't think print is as dead as people think. I can go to my Chapters/Indigo store (Kind'a like Barnes and Noble) and they have a very large section of magazines that are definitely a niche product. White Dwarf is there, a good number of knitting books, quite a few railroad magazines, all sorts of war magazines some obscure poetry and art magazines, little magazines about fantasy (Not restricted to wizards and knights) like; On Spec and plenty more.

These magazines have been in stock for as long as I can remember.

Comparing it to Kobold Quarterly is a little unfair as KQ was really a niche of a niche of a niche magazine.

I've also read that things like movies, board games, little things like that do well in a recession because the entertainment value is still there but doesn't cost as much.

This non-announcement is already causing a buzz (If you go by forums, here, RPGnet, Enworld etc.) which is a little free advertising for the mag.

The only blunder that I can see is the very short time of the announcement to production that they left themselves. I get why they've put a lid on it, wanting it to go-to-press to ensure the mag comes out when they said it would, because the use of the word vapor ware could be harmful to the mag. I figure pushing back the release date to January would give them time to advertise. I dunno if they pushed it so close for the X-mas season to get the X-mas crowd but my small slice of X-mas gift buying, I've never seen anyone buy a subscription as a present. (Not saying it doesn't happen and I know my personal experience doesn't mean much, but I'd gamble I'm pretty close.)

Being a quarterly magazine, I can't imagine that'll help, nor the fact that it is a unknown commodity, at this point.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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Sir Ironside wrote:Well if the Gygax name is well known within all the gaming community (More the new breed of rpger's) and they get noticed by the D&D/Pathfinder crowd you have a pretty big base to draw upon.
I'm not so sure that's true anymore. While there's certainly many people who recognize the name and what it stands for, I don't think that's true of the majority of gamers anymore. And even for some of those, the name Gygax may be a turn-off - say, for those who are dyed-in-the-wool World of Darkness types, or Dresden Files-style gamers. Those people are going to equate the name with a school of hack-and-slash play - not entirely without justification - that will, for them, be a turn-off.
I don't think print is as dead as people think.
Not yet dead, but definitely in transition and the economics are not working in their direction just yet. The Internet itself, coupled with digital publishing, is changing things.

What I do find encouraging is that Mr. Elliot seems to understand this, which I hope will help him successfully navigate those particular shoals.
I've also read that things like movies, board games, little things like that do well in a recession because the entertainment value is still there but doesn't cost as much.
That had been true of all post-WWII recessions prior to this one, but I'm not certain if it's held true this time. I'd certainly love to see the data on it! It does seem clear that gaming is doing well in some parts of the US and world.
The only blunder that I can see is the very short time of the announcement to production that they left themselves.
They've actually been working on this for over a year, according to Tim Kask and others, so I suspect the December issue has already been printed or is being printed now. They've also got advertisers in the first issue. It just appears that they were able to get everything done quietly.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by Hal G »

Hopefully optimistic!

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by Sir Ironside »

Sir Ironside wrote:Well if the Gygax name is well known within all the gaming community (More the new breed of rpger's) and they get noticed by the D&D/Pathfinder crowd you have a pretty big base to draw upon.
CKDad wrote:I'm not so sure that's true anymore. While there's certainly many people who recognize the name and what it stands for, I don't think that's true of the majority of gamers anymore. And even for some of those, the name Gygax may be a turn-off - say, for those who are dyed-in-the-wool World of Darkness types, or Dresden Files-style gamers. Those people are going to equate the name with a school of hack-and-slash play - not entirely without justification - that will, for them, be a turn-off.
D-ho! I just read what I wrote and it was the exact opposite as to what I meant. Simply put, the old Grognards know exactly who Gygax is, I meant to say, I'm not sure if the newer rpgers really know their history. I'd suspect they'd consider Monte Cook more of the torch holder than Gygax. But, I don't know, I just meant if they do understand the history of rpg's then Gygax will have meaning.
Not yet dead, but definitely in transition and the economics are not working in their direction just yet. The Internet itself, coupled with digital publishing, is changing things.
I've been saying this for awhile. But, it seems that there are other people not willing to give up their deadtree books. It isn't just gamers. There is a decline of real books, but it disappearance is a lot slower than I had thought. Now, video rentals went belly up pretty fast, I just don't seem the same timeline with books.
What I do find encouraging is that Mr. Elliot seems to understand this, which I hope will help him successfully navigate those particular shoals.
Agreed. You pretty much have to these days.

I'm also glad that people have stopped complaining about pdf prices. Books are more expensive because they have to be printed, shipped, warehoused then sold. I've always believed that a pdf should be priced by taking away those costs and whatever is left over should be the price (Or, thereabouts.) People seem to forget that it takes ideas, editing, art ect. to put out a quality pdf. They days of $50 books selling for $10 pdf are mostly over.
I've also read that things like movies, board games, little things like that do well in a recession because the entertainment value is still there but doesn't cost as much.
That had been true of all post-WWII recessions prior to this one, but I'm not certain if it's held true this time. I'd certainly love to see the data on it! It does seem clear that gaming is doing well in some parts of the US and world.
Sorry no stats to give you. I just watch some shows (Mostly news types) about the economy and they had said that the movie industry seemed to be not that much affected (from the last recession) because of my statement above. There are only 3 examples I can give that at least gives a little proof (I know 3 doesn't tell the whole story). Steve Jackson Games puts out a letter to its customers about the year that was and what they want to do for the year upcoming. In one of his letters, he did mention that there was a slight downturn in profits, during the recession, but what compounded the problem is they didn't keep up with the basic Munchkin sets and the demand outweighed the stock. I'm kind'a an online friend to Brian St.Clair of Vajra games and his sales didn't dip noticeably neither did BTRC that has the EABA system. From my perspective (And this is very limited) it seemed Paizo did pretty good during those times.

I'm just saying that during the recession, people didn't have the money to travel or any other expensive kind of leisure activities so they turned to cheaper things like movies and games.
The only blunder that I can see is the very short time of the announcement to production that they left themselves.
They've actually been working on this for over a year, according to Tim Kask and others, so I suspect the December issue has already been printed or is being printed now. They've also got advertisers in the first issue. It just appears that they were able to get everything done quietly.
It doesn't matter how long they've been working on it. I'm sure they have a completed issue. My whole point had to do with the timing of the release. It is late November, they want to have the first issue out in December, there is very little time to do advertising. It is all well and good you make your deadline, but if no one knows about it how you going to sell it? At the very least they should've started advertising 2 months ahead.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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CKDad wrote:
Sir Ironside wrote:Well if the Gygax name is well known within all the gaming community (More the new breed of rpger's) and they get noticed by the D&D/Pathfinder crowd you have a pretty big base to draw upon.
I'm not so sure that's true anymore. While there's certainly many people who recognize the name and what it stands for, I don't think that's true of the majority of gamers anymore. And even for some of those, the name Gygax may be a turn-off - say, for those who are dyed-in-the-wool World of Darkness types, or Dresden Files-style gamers. Those people are going to equate the name with a school of hack-and-slash play - not entirely without justification - that will, for them, be a turn-off.
It's definitely not as well known as it was, but I'll bet my last dollar it's still the most recognized name in gaming, and by far. Considering the hobby is aging with it's player base, I'd say that is the case. Those WoD and Dresden players aren't all newbies. But yes, the name - for some - will be elicit the older style of playing. I've seen a lot more people these days, however, embracing the older style of play via things like retro-clones and games like C&C.
CKDad wrote:
Sir Ironside wrote:I don't think print is as dead as people think.
Not yet dead, but definitely in transition and the economics are not working in their direction just yet. The Internet itself, coupled with digital publishing, is changing things.
Again, I agree with you CK. One thing this has going for it, though, is the nature of the hobby. I think a paper product "fits" better. I have no market research, or polls from gamers to back that up with, but it just feels like it. KQ was widely accepted, at least I thought so. And I don't think they're ending due to monetary issues. At least that's the impression I got from what I read. It seemed more that the effort isn't worth it. So I guess it is a monetary thing, but I don't think they're in the red. Maybe I'm wrong, though. On an anecdotal level, I know and have read many forums of people who left Dragon and Dungeon when they went electronic...but I don't know for sure if that was because of format or content.
CKDad wrote:
Sir Ironside wrote:The only blunder that I can see is the very short time of the announcement to production that they left themselves.
They've actually been working on this for over a year, according to Tim Kask and others, so I suspect the December issue has already been printed or is being printed now. They've also got advertisers in the first issue. It just appears that they were able to get everything done quietly.
Yes, this is an interesting approach. I've seen this a couple time recently (with this, and the Edge of the Empire Beta's near-unexpected release at GenCon, most notably) and I wonder what the motivation is. I like the surprise, personally. I've heard from the FFG people that one reason they went with a surprise release because they didn't want a lot of speculation rampant on the internet. On a personal level, I'm glad they didn't announce 10 months ago and then had me wait impatiently for its release. :)
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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Hal G wrote:Hopefully optimistic!
Agreed!
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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Well... the magazine clearly does not have support from the "Gygax Family Estate" --
I wish to clear up any confusion I am the proper owner of the use of the name of my late husband, E. Gary Gygax. And furthermore would ask respect from his public and children from his first marriage, who are fully aware I own all rights to the use of his name and likeness, and all intellectual properties.

We have previously informed Jason Elliot of my ownership rights.

I can understand the enthusiasm for this project and will remain neutral in regard to its merits however, not at the expense of the Gary Gygax Estate, which represents his wishes.

-- Gail Gygax
That said, a few words from Luke Gygax:
At this time Gail is not part of Gygax Magazine. Personally, I hope that she decides to come onboard in the future. All the posts from Gygax magazine staff I've seen were clear that this project is something Ernie and I are involved in as part of a larger team including Tim Kask, Jayson Elliot, James Carpio and Jim Wampler.

Gygax Magazine is supported by the Gygax family members who are actually gamers. Ernie (aka Ernest Gary Gygax Jr.) was the first person to playtest D&D, played numerous iconic characters in Greyhawk and worked for TSR through the 1980's. I cut my teeth on gaming and feel passionate about the positive aspects that gaming brings to people's lives. Gygax Magazine is a way for us to share our love of gaming both Old School and current systems with the gaming community. We are focused on producing a quality magazine and we hope that you will take the time to read the first issue in December.

Please realize that the information on Gygax Magazine was leaked ahead of our projected announce date. This resulted in unwanted confusion. I appreciate the excitement this has generated and I hope that the product meets expectations.
Wait and see is what a lot of people are likely going to do though I do think that some issues need to be obviously settled for this to be a success.

With regards to the economics of a print magazine -- it is do-able but format and pricing may need to change from what we already are familiar with to be a success. Print advertising for instance is not worth what it used to be which means partially funding production just won't work as well as it once did. Having recently looking into this, it is very possible to do if you have a base number of subscribers and everyone is willing to accept lower page counts and higher costs per issue. I believe it is do-able.

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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moriarty777 wrote:Well... the magazine clearly does not have support from the "Gygax Family Estate" --
I wish to clear up any confusion I am the proper owner of the use of the name of my late husband, E. Gary Gygax. And furthermore would ask respect from his public and children from his first marriage, who are fully aware I own all rights to the use of his name and likeness, and all intellectual properties.

We have previously informed Jason Elliot of my ownership rights.

I can understand the enthusiasm for this project and will remain neutral in regard to its merits however, not at the expense of the Gary Gygax Estate, which represents his wishes.

-- Gail Gygax
Unfortunately Gail doesn't really understand the what she owns and what she doesn't own. She's soon to find out though.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by tylermo »

Good luck, Luke and Ernie. I wish a great many other things were in your hands, as well. Looking forward to the first issue.

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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Arduin wrote:Unfortunately Gail doesn't really understand the what she owns and what she doesn't own. She's soon to find out though.
In any event, it's this sort of thing that can really hurt a new enterprise such as this...

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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moriarty777 wrote:
Arduin wrote:Unfortunately Gail doesn't really understand the what she owns and what she doesn't own. She's soon to find out though.
In any event, it's this sort of thing that can really hurt a new enterprise such as this...

M

Not really. Her legal position is pretty much nil.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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Arduin wrote:
moriarty777 wrote:
Arduin wrote:Unfortunately Gail doesn't really understand the what she owns and what she doesn't own. She's soon to find out though.
In any event, it's this sort of thing that can really hurt a new enterprise such as this...

M

Not really. Her legal position is pretty much nil.
Um... I wasn't referring to law. Just because you have the legal right to do something doesn't mean there will never be bad blood over family disagreements on how things should or shouldn't be done. Such a thing can add additional stresses and, should these issues spill out to the public -- divide some of that public opinion in taking sides.

I don't see how any of that would be beneficial even if there is no issue as far as the law is concerned. ;)

For a magazine start-up given the niche target audience, opinions and egos already in play, and the likelihood of a tight budget to get this off the ground means the littlest things could be the difference of a successful launch or a short-lived production.

All of this is regardless of legal positions but given what I had quoted from you, it is understandable that the assumption was I was talking law.

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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

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moriarty777 wrote: I don't see how any of that would be beneficial even if there is no issue as far as the law is concerned. ;)

I didn't say it was beneficial... Most of the buyers aren't going to care that Gail is in a tizzy (indeed, her blocking the GG Foundation from earning income from the publication of much sought after gaming material has given many a negative impression of her).

And, I don't think any of the producers of this mag are incompetent enough to let it distract them to the point of measurably degrading their work performance.
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Re: Gygax Magazine from TSR

Post by Breakdaddy »

Gents, please let's get this puppy back on topic. The Trolls are friendly with the Gygax family and we would appreciate it if this thread could remain on the topic of the magazine itself and not any internal strife that might be going on within the family.
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